Thursday, 12 October 2023

De Bellis Fantasiae comparison with De Bellis Fantasticus

 


Once there was a publication called DBF.  The rules are dead.  Long live the rules!   Seems to be out of print for a few years.   I got permission to add the army lists here.  

Many thanks to Matt Hay as my printer won't scan 'cos of chrome, or covid or something--.   I've had me jabs!

I used these rules way back in the before time (80's) when, 
in 6mm we'd spend a happy day of unemployment (as opposed to Entoyment)  fighting army list vs army list.  Come the glorious move I'll find out these armies and rebase them.  I've even got 3 Baccus armies:  WOR, medieval and renaissance Japanese.  

I'm going to have a look at some of the differences.  Getting my head around this lot---.


BUT REMEMBER  I'm using the first beta version, which may be quite different from the final published product.  Which is why we do testing.

Using either set of army lists.  A simple spreadsheet will give you your army in minutes.  For long term play you might like to add a "got" column after the min/max.

Formations:

+1 If Pike Phalanx v. Mounted or Skirmishers

+3 If Pike Phalanx v. all other Foot.

+1 If Light Mounted Circle Shooting (combat, rear support same) v. all

+1 Warband Mass (rear support same) v. Foot

+1 Shieldwall solid spear flanked by other spear Solid Blades or Cleric v. Foot.

+1 Retinue (Solid Bows and supported by Solid Blades) v. Foot.

An Element may only benefit from a maximum of one Formation

Fast Elements do not benefit from Side Support Formations

Flank & Rear:

-1 For each enemy Element Overlapping (2 Maximum).

-1 For enemy Element in full front edge contact with rear.

Status:

+1 If the General's Element.

-1 If Broken.  (Lost half with some units)  

A lost General’s Element counts as 1 extra Lost Element

A lost Dragon or one that has not been re-deployed counts as 2 Lost Elements

Characters count as 2 Lost Elements

Unwieldy Troops cost 2 pips to move.

The following Elements are Unwieldy: Aerials, Artillery, Hordes, Behemoths and Infernal Machines and any Element that starts a move in a City, Castle or Camp.

An enemy Element of Knights, Behemoths, Beasts or Hordes Pursues the Element breaking-off and moves 1BW straight ahead.

Ranged Combat Movement Limitations

A Bow or Infernal Machine Element may move up to 1BW in the preceding Movement Phase and still shoot.  A Bow or Infernal Machine Element that moved more than 1BW, and Artillery Elements that moved any distance, may not shoot in that Bound.

Artillery Elements and Crossbow Elements can only shoot in their own Bound.


Here's 3 I've been playing with:          


Duchy of FenwickNameMin/MaxNumberPointsTotal
BladeGeneral111010
Blade AllySub General0-2155
Knights2-6050
Barding010
Cleric188
Warbow/crossbowRetinue Bow2-86424
BladeRetinue Blade2-86530
Spear12-366530
Poor volley gunArtillery2-6248
Artillery0-2050
Skirmishers0-8030
Hordes0-128324
Shooters0-66424
Shooters Long or C/bow0-240
AuxilarySailors0-36424
Auxilary inferiorSailors0-330
Behemoth166
Greater beast0-3050
Greater Flyers0-20200
Flyers0-550
193


Imperial states (French)NameMin/MaxNumberPointsTotal
KnightGeneral111010
Sub General0-2155
SuperiorKnights4-124520
Other Knights050
Barding616
Cavalry0-44416
BladeHalberdier6-1650
Pike4-1616464
Fast gunArtillery0-350
Artillery0-32510
Skirmishers0-126318
Hordes0-1230
Crossbow4-1240
Longbow0-840
InferiorSpear0-1250
AuxilarySailors0-340
Greater beast0-33515
Greater Flyers0-212020
Flyers0-5040
184

Name  ItalianMin/MaxNumberPointsTotal
General111010
Sub General0-2155
Knights2-66530
Barding717
0
Retinue Bow2-840
Retinue Blade2-850
Pike12-3624496
Artillery2-6248
Artillery0-2155
Skirmishers0-88324
Hordes0-1230
Shooters0-640
Shooters Long or C/bow0-240
Sailors0-330
Sailors0-330
Greater beast0-33515
Greater Flyers0-20200
Flyers0-540
200


As you can see, this was a very thorough set.  When playing the varying effects of the different variables slowed play down and encouraged the rules lawyer.  "ah yes, but this unit is X's meaning that you get pushed back".

Lettuce compare that to the proposed:

Rule:

Extra Point Cost:

Barding: Mounted Elements count as Foot for Ranged Combat.

+1

(used this worked)

Battle Frenzy: +1 on a winning score, but -1 on a losing score, in Close Combat.

0


Dismount: Mounted Element may be replaced by a designated Element matching the front to front. Costs 2 PIPs to dismount per Element. This may not be done in an enemy Threat Zone. The dismounted Element may not move in the Phase it dismounts.

0


Elite: Elements convert any combat die rolls of “2” to a “5”.

+2


Poor: Elements convert any combat die roll of “5” to a “2”.

-1


Ethereal: Element ignores Terrain for both movement and combat.

+1


Foot Hero: As a Hero Element but counted as a Foot Element. Move is 2BW in good going/ 1BW in other going.

-1


Heavy Armour: Adds +1 if the Element receives a Doubled Result in combat.

+1


Handgunnes: Count as Crossbows, but with a range of 2BW. They are Lethal in Ranged Combat.

0


Lethal: Add +1 on a winning score in combat.

+1


Mortar: As Artillery, but with a Range 4BW; may shoot over any other Elements.

0


Polearms: Count as Spears, but with the Retinue formation, instead of Shieldwall. They are Lethal.

0


Sneaker: Ignore the Camp or Castle Close Combat Tactical Modifier bonus when attacking. They treat both as +0

+1


Undead: Ignore Recoil Results in Ranged Combat, but count Recoiled as Destroyed in Close Combat.

0


Volley Gun: As Artillery, but with a 3BW range. It counts as Lethal.

0

I need to work though these.  I tried making my Landsneckts elite.  I either forgot (add to army list!) or the extra 6  strips ---.  Plus combinations - If classed Volley Guns as poor?


























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